Welcome everybody. I am super excited to let you hear from one of my amazing clients, Summer. Uh, I wanted to start by just hyping up Summer a little bit, because she’s one of my favorite, I think all, everybody’s my favorite, but I have just loved working with you so much. I was thinking of like words that described you or like what our time together has been like and I remember when we first met that and I don’t know if you would identify with this but I put decisive because I feel like when you came to coaching it was like a really tough time but then you’re like I need this this is what I want and like really dove in um and I was just like so proud of you for that committed because again when you Go into something you’re all in, um, in so many areas of your life.

I really admire that about you. And then willing to try things even when it’s hard. Um, I’ve loved watching you even when it’s like, yeah, it’s hard. And sometimes we don’t even know what what’s coming next, but you’re always willing to try. And then I love,, this came up like a lot throughout our coaching was like how intuitive you are, that you’re able to like.

Really listen to yourself when you give yourself the space to do that. And, um, you have such like great. Ideas and like intuition and like that inner guidance I think is really, really cool. So I’m excited for everybody to get to hear from you. Um, so I’m just gonna kind of give you a minute here to answer the first question that I ask everybody, which is, and you can introduce yourself a little bit, however you want, but also just tell us about your baby’s lives, any memories you have.

Because we talk so much about their deaths and their losses. But yeah, a little something about your babies and then any lessons that they taught you. Yeah.

Well, first of all, thank you. I feel so flattered. You said such nice things about me, but, um, yeah, so my, um, my angel babies, we have three, husband and I, his name is Caleb.

And we refer to them by the birthstone of their due date. So for our three, the Citrine, Emerald, and Moonstone. Um, and I was trying to think of memories and stories, and there was one that just stood out that was just a, just a fun experience. But. Um, with our first baby, , which is the Citrine, uh, birthstone, um, we were so excited to tell our families and our, , my sister in law, she had just gotten married and moved into a new place with her husband and she wanted to host a party for everybody to come and see her new place.

So she invited the whole family over and before. A couple days before the event, she texted and was like, I want to play this game where everybody will write down two things that nobody else in the family knows, and we’ll put it in a basket, and then we’ll draw them out, and we’ll all guess who wrote what, and then, you know, see who gets the most points.

And Caleb and I were just, It was just the perfect scenario. It’s like she knew that we had news, but of course she didn’t. But, um, so I wrote on one of my slips of paper, um, I have a bun in the oven. And the whole game, I was just like, my heart was pounding. I’m like, Oh, when is she going to read mine? Um, but eventually she pulls it out, she reads it, and for a second it’s just like quiet, like everyone’s processing what they just heard, and then the room just like exploded, everyone was so excited, and, um, I don’t know, just the energy of that moment, and the, the, how perfect it was, the game that she wanted to play, I feel like it’s just kind of a funny memory from, you know, That first pregnancy, some other things about our babies, um, the second one, we didn’t know the gender of any of them, but the second baby, um, our Emerald baby, I just, for some reason, couldn’t talk about that pregnancy without saying she, like, I just thought it was a girl. And I’m so interested to know, like, if that was right or wrong.

Um, and I haven’t really had that experience with any of my other pregnancies. Um, so I thought that that was kind of interesting. But yeah, that’s kind of a little bit about, um, our angel babies. . So as for lessons that they taught me, um,

It’s kind of like, Oh, there’s so many things I could say, but some things that I, um, thought about were empathy. I feel like I’ve learned so much about empathy and I’m, I’m like, surely there are times where I don’t see it, but I feel like it’s a little bit easier for me to see and notice people who may be like silently suffering.

Right. Oh, sorry.

Um, and I’ve been really grateful for that. Um, like I’ve had family members that, um, are going through different, different trials and experiences in their life, but I, I’ve been able to, try and just give, understand that and give space for, for how that’s affecting their life. Um, where I feel like, um, before these babies, um, I just couldn’t, I couldn’t see it as well.

You know, I hadn’t experienced it as much myself. So, um, and then I was thinking about how, um, I am, I’m Christian. I believe in Jesus Christ and, um, I think these babies really taught me more about, um, Jesus Christ and the gift that he offers us. Um, and just the depth of that. Um, and then the last thing I would say is that.

Sometimes I’m a really visual person. Sometimes they think about life as like this canvas and, um, kind of who we are as like the color, um, the paint on the canvas. Right. Um, and I feel like our babies really taught us that some depth and some splashes of color and, um, some things maybe you didn’t expect, right.

They can really be make your life. Um, It can be a beautiful thing. So, um, yeah, that’s what I would say that I learned from these babies.

Yeah. I love that. Right. That whole idea of contrast and needing all the experiences and the feelings and the, these little beings that are a part of you, um, to add, you know, we can have this idea of what our life’s like.

Painting would look like, um, but yeah, sometimes we get different, different things. And I would say that’s a kind of an overarching theme of our time together. And maybe like, we can talk about it as we, we just have this conversation, but like when you came to me, you had experienced one loss, right?

Yes.

Yeah. And then throughout our time together. We’re able to get pregnant and had two more losses. So why don’t we just start like, where were you? So you were so excited. You got to announce this baby at the party, which I think is such a cute memory. And like, yeah, totally. Like, I don’t believe in coincidence.

I think that’s so cool. I’ve never even heard of that game, but like, yeah, I just have that perfect opportunity to share. Um, you know, you’re, you’re there, you’re excited, you’re ready to grow your family and kind of like, then what happened?

Yeah. Um, well, I, our first loss was, um, a subchorionic hemorrhage. Um, and so if you’re not familiar with that, um, basically how I remember the, the ER doctor explaining it to me, which who knows how well I’m remembering that, but. Where the, the baby, um, kind of pulls off of the uterine lining and it creates this hemorrhage, um, and most what they explained to me is that most of the time they resolve, um, And it’s pretty rare that it ends in miscarriage.

Um, but ours did. And I think, um, it was right around Easter time when this was happening. And, um, it just kind of, for a few months, I was in a pretty, just, I don’t know, dark place. Um, and I think

a lot of it was just not having any idea of, like, where to turn, right? Thanks. Sorry,

Like I remember probably a month after my first loss, suddenly having this realization that like, there are things out there that are built to help people who experience grief and loss. And I was, I just thought it was kind of funny. I guess a month isn’t that long in the grand scheme of things, but I was like, how come I didn’t think about this before?

So, I don’t know. I think that was a big part of just feeling just in a really dark place. But, um, yeah, I mean, it just really struggled with, Um, depression and, um, I feel like, I don’t know if this is, you can cut this off. This is too much. No, just, yeah. I’ll start this sentence. Amy: We like too much. Um, yeah, I just was, I was really struggling as, um, just dealing with a lot of depression and anxiety and to be totally honest, um, had experienced some suicidal ideation, which was really, I’d never experienced that before and I haven’t.

Outside of, um, the context of our losses. Um, I just didn’t know what to do. Right. Um, I really struggled with my personal relationships. Um, I felt just really misunderstood, and I think a big part of that is, is that like my self identity was really challenged, um, and even,

even my self worth, right, like, as a woman, um, and it was hard for me to have these relationships when it’s like I didn’t know how to be myself anymore, I didn’t know how to be, you know, a sister anymore. Man.

Okay. Yeah. And I’ll just say, I’ll give you a minute and you know, I think a lot of people can relate, especially if you have family or like in laws, friends, like When you’re in this season where there’s a lot of babies, there’s, you know, or there’s like family gatherings, there’s things and you just feel out of place, you know, and there’s just so many triggers and, no matter how much you love each other or like trying to, you know, everyone’s trying to support, it can just feel really isolating.

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Um, and. At this point in time, I, I really just didn’t see a way out. Like I didn’t know, I couldn’t even imagine myself feeling better. Um, and I had no idea, like, if that was possible, how to get there. Um, so yeah, that’s kind of where I started, where I was, um, a few months after our first loss.

Um, and I started listening to other people’s stories. I was mostly listening to podcasts, um, and I just wanted, I guess, to find some sense of like community, like normalcy and like what I had experienced, right? Um, especially having been told, like, like my situation was rare, right? I was like, there’s gotta be someone else.

Not that I wanted someone else to experience that, but I, I, I was kind of seeking that like validation and that like. Support. Um, so I wanted to just hear other people’s stories. Um, so podcasts, um, and I, I don’t even know if I’ve shared this with you, Amy, but I, I listened to a podcast that you were a guest on, and then I started listening to your podcast cause I had, um, I really liked what you shared in the other, um, podcasts where you were a guest.

So. Um, and I was driving home from a trip to a bridal shower, had like a three hour drive home. I was by myself. And I listened to your podcast for literally the entire three hours, just episode after episode. And I, when I got home, I was telling Caleb, my husband, like it was like the first time Since I had experienced the loss that I felt like maybe I can be okay one day, like maybe I will feel all right.

Not that all of a sudden I felt better in that moment. I didn’t, right. But it was like that glimmer of like, Oh, like it’s possible people have done it. You’ve done it right. Like, um, and I feel like that was a really big game changer for me and, um, eventually what led me to, to coaching with you.

Oh, that’s beautiful.

And I love, that’s what I love about podcasting. Cause it is like, you can just have that person. And I’ve had that experience too, where I found something and I was like, Oh my goodness, this is like, gonna change everything and um, give me the hope and give me the tools and like, tell me how do I do this?

Like how do I do, whether it’s parenting or marriage or like grief or whatever, life goals. Right. Cause there’s like so many things we all want to do. Um, but that’s really beautiful. And thank you for sharing that. I don’t think you did tell me, I knew you found me from like a different podcast, but like, I didn’t know that you like binged.

But yeah, that’s awesome. That’s like my favorite if I ever get to drive alone, um, to just listen to podcasts. But, but yeah, I, and I gotta just say, like, I appreciate you being so honest and just sharing. You know, how hard it is and how, like, sad you can be. And, um, I think a lot of people can relate to that.

So, um, let’s just talk a little bit. And again, I feel like because you had this thread throughout of like, Trying again, wanting to have a baby, wanting to grow your family, and then having losses throughout our time together. Um, maybe you can just share a little bit about Like, what were some of the things that helped you?

What are some of the things that maybe stood out to you? Um, while we were working together, because, and I want for everyone listening to know that like, when I coach someone, it’s not about me, like telling you what to do. I’m happy to like provide guidance if needed, but it’s really about. Like helping summer find summer’s answers, um, along the way.

And, and so, yeah, I just love to hear maybe a couple of things that stood out to you, um, as we like work together.

Yeah. Um, well really, I think in general, what I love about, um, Coaching is just how, like, usable it is, I guess. Um, I think therapy and therapists are a great thing. It wasn’t, it didn’t end up being the right fit for me.

I tried two of them at the beginning when I was in that really dark place. Um, and I just felt like I, I needed something more. I needed them to, to, um, help me like inch my way forward to where I wanted to be, and I got a lot of validation and that was great, but I wasn’t getting like that, that progress that I felt like I was needing and.

That’s what I really love about coaching. It’s like through, I learned so much through it all. And I feel like, uh, like I, along the way just gained, um, like gathered so many strategies and tools for life, um, that I can like lean on and remember, um, for any situation. So I just love that about coaching in general.

, But I feel like specifically, um, one of the, one thing I think, um, that really stood out to me, , during our time coaching together was, , learning how to explore my feelings. Sometimes that’s really hard. My husband likes to use the phrase like emotionally constipated. Sorry if that sounds gross.

Um, I feel like sometimes we feel like that. Like we don’t, we don’t like whatever we’re feeling or something feels off, but we like, can’t put a finger on it. And it just kind of like simmers and bothers us. I don’t know. And. I feel, um, I would experience that, but also to experience these really strong emotions and just like not know where they’re coming from or what to do with them.

And sometimes you don’t find those answers, but I feel like, um, I really loved being guided through, um, different ways to, like, explore those emotions and just understand them better. And I feel like for me, that was, um, really helpful. Like when I could understand them a little bit better, give space or honor them, um, like accept that they’re part of, you know, Who I am in my experience, um, then it was easier for me to, to let them go if I wanted to.

And when I was ready to, um, and it just helped me like make more sense of what was going on inside of my brain and, and, um, also like find empathy for myself, like in different. Like reactions that I would have to certain situations and be like, Oh, of course I, I felt that way in that situation because like, I’m experiencing this under the surface.

Um, so I think that was so valuable for me. Um, another thing I was thinking about was just learning. to trust myself. Um, one story that comes to mind is after our third loss. Um, I was, it was, it was a doozy like the first few days after, and I just, Felt like I was gonna explode. Like I just did not know how to handle like experiencing this again, right and I had the thought I was like, I just want to go to Disneyland and My husband was like, are you sure that’s a good thing?

Like are you just escaping your reality? and Deciding to do something kind of expensive When you’re not like in a normal state of mind, I guess. Um, he was just kind of unsure about it. And I had those thoughts too. I was like, I mean, I feel like in, in general, there’s this thought of like, Oh, you shouldn’t, you shouldn’t try and escape your feelings or run away from, from your life or whatever.

And so I was kind of, um, Labeling that idea as like that, right. And that, that was. Not going to serve me. Um, but I remember, um, like, I feel like we, we were talking about it and you just kind of opened my eyes to like being able to trust like that desire, um, for me to, to, um, to go and do something that sounded fun, like for something to sound fun and desirable in the middle of having a loss, it’s like great.

Like let myself experience that and have a break from. The panic attacks and everything that was, you know, going on with the loss. Um, anyway, so we went and it was like, so uncharacteristic for us to just like get in the car and go and book an Airbnb while we’re driving. Um, but it ended up being like.

Exactly what I needed. And of course, like, it’s not like Disneyland is some like magical, like fix to the problems, like it’s not at all, but I, I needed that like relief for just a couple of days of, um, like from sitting in my room and crying. Right. Like I needed something different and I feel like that story just really.

That experience really taught me a lot about, like, just not labeling thoughts or ideas or feelings as, like, right or wrong or good or bad, um, and, and just being able to, like, trust that I know, I, I can know how to take care of myself, um, And, and I think some other experiences too, like that, even if someone else doesn’t agree, um, or maybe it even upsets them the way I decide to take care of myself, um, that like, I can find peace knowing that I did what I needed to do.

Right. Um, so I, yeah, I think that was, that was another big thing that’s, that stands out to me from coaching.

Yeah. I love that. I love just like. Giving that permission slip, right? It’s like, it’s already inside. Like there’s these things that we want to do, but we have all these reasons we don’t. Um, and that’s what something that I was thinking as you were telling your story is just that, and maybe you can share a little bit about, cause I know something that kind of.

Was hard. And I think it’s a hard for a lot of us, especially women is like, we want to be nice and we want to make sure everyone around us is happy. And so it’s like, if, yeah, if there’s a big event going on and you don’t feel like you can go or whatever, I think there was that struggle, right? Like that tug of war of like, I wouldn’t necessarily say people pleasing, but basically that, like just being so concerned with what everyone else is going to think or feel.

If you take care of yourself. So, um, so yeah, just like being a nice, good person. A lot of us want to be nice, good people. Um, but yeah, it’s like, it’s really hard when you’re trying to just like manage everyone’s thoughts. and emotions around you. So, I mean, what would you say to someone who also might relate to that?

Yeah.

I, I feel like I learned that it’s really, it just hurt me, you know, maybe it hurt other people, but it like, I was the one that was affected by it, I think the most. And the reason I say that is because, um, I would think I don’t want to go to this, this event. And then I would Oh, everyone’s going to be mad at me.

They’re going to think that I don’t like them. They’re going to think that I’m making this a bigger deal than it is. And who knows if they have those thoughts or not? Like I, I just would worry that people would have those thoughts. And then I would start to be. get upset almost at like things that haven’t happened.

I’d be like, well, if they’re upset with me or not wanting to come, then like, that’s stupid because I’ve, I’m having a really hard time, you know? And so I was like, in this vicious cycle of like thinking I need to people, please. And then being upset that I need to people, please. And then realizing like, I just.

can’t, you know, like, I just have to do what I need to do. I’m in charge of my emotions and they’re in charge of theirs. And I guess maybe this sounds harsh, but I guess it’s just kind of a part of life that sometimes people’s decisions upset other people. And you just can’t take responsibility for that.

Like my intention is not to hurt anybody. It’s to protect. Myself. Right. So I don’t know. I, and, and I really think like a lot of the worries that would come up on my brain where my anxiety, like trying to, you know, warn me or protect me about various what ifs. Right. And it’s like, nobody, like, maybe nobody ever would have had that thought.

Right. Um, and so it’s, it’s just, you can’t, you I don’t know. Can’t make assumptions, I guess.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think it is like, honestly, we’re taught though, we’re taught to think about other people’s What they’re going to think, what they’re going to feel right. And we want, I think there’s that balance of like, we can still be a caring person.

We can still figure out like who we are and who we want to be and also learn to say no. Right. And also learn to like, let go of some of that. spiraling those stories that just, I think that’s the extra layer of suffering. I talk a lot about like, there’s the pain and the sadness and the grief and the other, you know, struggles that we’re going through.

And the suffering is like, Yeah. That whole story that we put on top of it. Um, or yeah, maybe we’re getting into other people’s like business or imagining things or telling ourselves, you know, all these terrible things are going to happen, um, based on what we decide to do or how we act or whatever.

Well, I was just going to say, sometimes I would even think about it. I’m like, worst case scenario. What if they did think that about me? Right. And remind myself that like, Sometimes, like, I have thoughts about situations or people that aren’t, like, always 100 percent happy and perfect. Like, sometimes I get upset about various things, too.

It’s like, that’s just part of being human, you know? Like, and I can’t, like, judge someone else for having a reaction, right? Like, we all have reactions to things, and, um, I don’t know. Just, just like, we’re, we all do it. We’re all, we’re all just trying our best. Um, and, and that’s okay. You know?

Yeah. Well, and I love that.

And it’s really profound. Like, if someone hasn’t learned this already, Like, because you’ve practiced it a lot, right? It’s like, yeah, worst case scenario is, they are judging me. They are gossiping behind my back. They are, you know, like, whatever is happening. And you can just say like, so what? Like, I just, I choose.

Me, right. And I, I’m okay with letting that happen because our brain is like, but you’re going to die. Like if someone doesn’t like you or someone’s whatever that you’re going to die. But like you said, I mean, it was, It’s killing you. I mean, that’s kind of, you know, a strong word, but I think that’s maybe what it felt like sometimes when you’re just like trying to control all the things.

It’s too much. And it’s like, I already have a lot to deal with. Right? It’s like adding someone else’s emotions onto the pile. It just, it’s, it was too much.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, I wanted to ask you a little bit about. Pregnancy after loss. Since you did go through that, um, could you share maybe just like what it was like wanting to try again or how you made those decisions and like, you know, kind of coming to terms with, cause I know you had this huge desire.

To be a mom and to have a living baby, but the timeline, I know it was like within a year, you had these three losses. Was it, I mean, what you probably know more specifically, but it was a lot to go through. Um, so maybe just tell us a little bit about like. What that journey was like for you and maybe anything that stood out, um, to you as far as having that faith and that fear of trying again.

Yeah.

Yeah. So my, our losses did, they happened very quickly. Um, and I, I, it was interesting because I think after the first loss, the sub Corona hemorrhage and it being. The doctors told me that it was a random event. I have no higher chance of having another miscarriage. Um, and so I, I didn’t really feel that scared.

I felt like I had had my bad luck was spent. Um, and. Things would be fine, right? Um, and I, sometimes I get a habit of thinking like, oh well this is what was meant to be all along and I like, think that multiple times and I’m like, oh I guess, I guess the other one wasn’t what was meant to be and so, anyway, but um Um I remember thinking that, like, with our second pregnancy, like, oh, this, this was, this timing, I guess, was what was meant to be all along.

And, um, I really did not feel, like, both me and my husband, it was very interesting. experience because we did not feel like any ounce of fear about that pregnancy, um, like ending in another loss. And like looking back, I’m like, that is remarkable because I’ve experienced it now. Um, and I really just think it was a gift from God, truthfully.

, and when it ended in the loss, I feel like it was just kind of confusing. I feel like that’s probably the word that I would, um, put on it. I didn’t understand. Like what my life was supposed to be, where my life was going. I didn’t understand like medically anything. And I feel like that for someone who’s experienced recurrent loss, I think a lot of people can relate because there’s not a lot of information out there.

Um, I think what the fertility clinic told me was that 50 percent of, of, um, loss parents end up, um, finding a. So like something that they can treat and then the other 50 percent don’t find anything. Um, and to me, that just says it’s so like, there’s so much we don’t know. And so I’m like, if the experts don’t know, I have no medical background.

Like. I’m so confused. I don’t understand, um, how to help myself and where to turn.

Um, but you did try hard to though. I think that was another thing that we talked a lot about was just like, you’re trying so hard to like eat healthy and like stay away from all like the living a clean life. So you can give yourself the best chance of a healthy baby, which is great.

And maybe you could speak a little bit to when it. Like tipped over into like, um, like a little more of a struggle.

Yeah, I feel like it’s so hard. Um, because there’s so many people in your life that love you and they want you to have your greatest dream come true. Right. And so they’ll say, Oh, have you tried this?

Have you tried that? And then you have your, your own research endless Google searches that I don’t recommend. Um, Of things that you want to do or try and then maybe you have a doctor tell you so there’s just like a lot of things that you can try. And then even within like when you decide, if you decide to try something to improve your, your chances, your health, there’s like this whole scale of like, yeah, I can be really intense about it or I can, You know, dapple in it.

Um, I feel like I have a tendency, like you were saying at the beginning, I usually go all in. So I had a tendency to get really intense about things. Um, and that, um, I feel like, you know, with all things in life, you kind of just have to be forgiving and find balance because, sure, maybe certain foods, you Um, or, um, activities, right.

Can impact your fertility. Um, but what about the rest of your life? You know, it’s like, that’s obviously a huge core desire, but if I’m experiencing like anxiety, because. I don’t have time to make dinner, but I don’t want to go out and get fast food because that’s not good for me and my fertility. It’s like, like, I don’t know.

There’s just kind of a point where it’s like, it’s not serving you anymore. Right. And, um, so I don’t know that I’ve really found that balance. Um, but I guess I just feel like, like, I remember you telling me a lot of during coaching like to just give yourself grace, right? Um, and I, and I think like if I could give my past self advice would be like to, if I want to do something to improve my chances or, you know, try and improve my chances, then, then do what I want to do and, um, just be really.

Like, uh, gentle with myself. Right. Um, because you’re not really in a place to be like hard on yourself or extreme or hold yourself to really high standards. Um, so yeah.

Yeah. Well, and I say all the compassion, like something we talk a lot about is just like, how is this totally understandable? Like it makes a ton of sense because it’s like, we can control.

our food or we can control our exercise or we can control what supplements we’re taking or not taking or you know what we’re avoiding what we’re doing because it does it’s like okay I feel like I’m doing something when life is so out of control like you didn’t have control of your losses and so Yeah, just having that compassion of being gentle, even when you’re in that, like when you’re deep into intensely trying to control your, your health and fertility, um, it’s like we can love that part of us that is just trying everything, right?

Because it, it, it comes from within. Love really. And like trying to create this family that you’ve been dreaming about and also just recognizing when it’s like, okay, maybe I need to take a breath and it’s, you know, maybe good to have someone to talk to about that and just kind of figure out, um, like you said, being okay with having fast food once in a while or whatever it is to like, just give yourself some, some grace to give yourself a little bit of a break.

Um, so speaking of a break, you did have a moment where you kind of, I don’t know, in your journey of pregnancy after loss, and it was a lot. Um, and we had talked about maybe like taking a minute to regroup. So what was that like? you know, in the midst of this year of, of losses and then knowing when you’re ready to like, try again.

Yeah. Um, yeah. So my third loss actually happened like within two months after my second. And so that was all kind of a whirlwind. And at that point, Um, I think I, I would call it like hibernation. I went, I went into emotional hibernation. Um, and I took two months to just, Like give my brain and my heart and my body a break from like, even thinking about, um, like fertility, trying to conceive, like I just decided that I was going to, and it ended up being like the rest of that year, like until the new year, I’m just, I’m not gonna, gonna think about it.

Like. And not necessarily think about, like, my losses, but I’m not going to think about, like, how to move forward. Um, I was just going to let myself, like, exist and live life for a few months. Um, and I don’t, I don’t really remember, like, what led to that decision. Um, but I just, I think it was just so needed.

Um, I had just got like, my anxiety had just gotten so high and, and confusion at the max and, um, I just didn’t know what to do. And I felt so much stress of like, how do I fix this? Like, how do I get the family that I want? And now after having three losses, there were questions of like, well, Do like, what about adoption?

What about foster care? Like there were just so many things swimming in my brain. And so I had to just be like, Hey, I’m just going to put that in a drawer and pick it up later. Um, and so I did and it’s, um, it’s interesting because. I guess, I guess just like, as those months went by, I found some clarity, even like without proactively thinking about how I wanted to move forward.

Um, but then like when the new year came. It was like, I know I want to reach out to the fertility clinic and, um, and move forward with them. Right. Versus like some of the other options that I was seeking, um, or thinking about. And um, yeah, so I, so I feel like not only was the like emotional hibernation so good for, for my heart to just like, Take a little bit of breathing room.

Um, but also like it gave my brain some time to just like, uh, settle, I guess. And, and then I found that I actually knew exactly what I wanted to do. I just, Figure it out with all the, like the anxiety that I was experiencing. So, yeah. And at that point, um, I took like the two month break and then I decided to work with the fertility center, um, and working with them, um, took quite a while.

Um, so we ended up having. almost a year break, um, where we weren’t trying to conceive at all. Um, and I think it was hard, um, in some ways because of course I want, I want a family, I want a child. And so, like, occasionally I would be like, Well, should I just, should I try, like, should we roll the dice again? I don’t know.

Like, cause I had, I had some friends that would do that. They would be doing their testing, um, with a fertility center or with their provider, right. But through all of it, they would keep trying and we decided to not. Um, and so sometimes I would question that decision, but, um, at the end of the day, I feel like it just was.

The option that made me feel most secure. Um, and I, and I needed that. So, yeah.

Yeah. And I think part of it too, is that rollercoaster, right? Of like every month up and down, up and down, like it just, it’s like, let’s just, let’s just step off of it for a second, but that wasn’t easy, right? Because. It’s not easy, especially when you’ve been like pushing for this baby for so long.

So I was really proud of you for even opening up to just like sitting for a minute and resting. Cause I know a lot of people relate to that where it’s like, but I have to keep doing and trying and pushing. And it’s like, sometimes we just like give it a minute. You know, um, that, that takes work and like bravery and courage and, um, to do that.

So, well, I would love to talk to you for like ever, you have such a, like, inspiring story. Um, why don’t you just tell us kind of where things are for you now? And, you know, maybe like one thing that you feel like really helped you, um, get here.

Yeah. If you don’t mind, real quick, I wanted to say about the fertility clinic.

Um, I, um, I was told, and I had friends that were told by various providers that, um, you need to have four losses or three losses to turn to a fertility clinic, but I just feel like I want to use this platform to say, if somebody is telling you that don’t. You don’t have to listen. Um, there’s no secret rule out there about how many losses you need to have before you like get medical help.

Um, the fertility clinic I went to didn’t even ask me. Um, and. I found clinics in other cities that will do fertility testing before you even start trying to conceive. So, I just, my heart breaks for women out there that feel like they have to experience loss after loss after loss before they can even have options.

So, I just wanted to put that out there.

I agree. And I hope that that’s shifting. Cause I feel like people are saying like, why this doesn’t even make sense, you know, so hopefully we’ll make some shifts, but yeah, I love that too. I’m all for just. Doing everything you can.

Yeah. Um, yeah. So where I’m at right now, um, I’m currently experiencing, um, another pregnancy after a loss, um, 18 weeks pregnant with a little boy, which we are so grateful for and so excited about.

Um, This is by a good amount of time the farthest that we’ve gotten into a pregnancy. Um, so yeah, um, It’s, it’s been interesting like reflecting on this pregnancy. I, I think I have experienced more anxiety during this pregnancy than any of my others. Um, at the beginning, especially I would have like waves, um, where it’s like multiple days where it was just like pretty constant.

And then I would have Um, you know, a wave I’m feeling okay, um, and even still, um, I experienced the anxiety and I remember us talking about that too, like sometimes when people get out of the first trimester after, um, miscarriages or recurrent losses, then they, it’s like, uh, a turning point for them and sometimes it’s not, and sometimes it’s earlier or later or, you know, you know, everyone’s experience is different.

And for me, like I’ve noticed it get better, but I still feel, um, I still feel anxiety. I still have bad dreams and I still have, um, like, I have a lot of ultrasounds given my history. And every time I just still, like my heart is pounding and I’m just like, Oh, please, please, please let everything be okay.

I think what I’ve experienced this time around is that, um, just kind of a sense of acceptance of it, like instead of being scared of the fear, um, being understanding of the fear and acknowledging like, of course I have those thoughts and those feelings sometimes. Um, like how could I not, right? Um, and I don’t know, of course, everyone’s experience is different, but I feel like it was just really a lesson I feel like I’ve learned in coaching.

Just being able to, um, like allow, like give space for those fears, um, lets you to like feel it and then also just let it continue down the stream of thought, right. Um, and, and then feel other things. And it’s like, it’s instead of like constantly feeling fear, it’s like, yeah, sometimes fear will come up and then you let it go and then you can feel excitement again.

Um, or, or whatever other feelings come up with the pregnancy and whatnot. So, um, yeah, it’s interesting. And I also feel like something I’ve taken, um, with me is like that, that hibernation I was talking about. I feel like I’ve had like, Almost a part two of hibernation. Um, I’ve cut out a lot of things in my life that were like, uh, that I were, um, optional, I guess.

Um, and so I just had less on my to do list. I turned off a lot of notifications, deleted a lot of apps, um, and just tried to like, minimize what was going on in my life. And I, um, I think that has been really helpful for me too, because it’s like, you only have so much capacity. And. Um, there’s a lot that you experience in pregnancy after recurrent loss.

And so just like trying to make as much space as possible for myself and what I’m experiencing and thinking and feeling, I feel like has , made a big difference. And it, I just kind of occurred to me recently that like, Oh, this is, this is like that other hibernation that I did. It looks a little different, different circumstance, but kind of the same.

Same idea that I applied.

Yeah. That thing where we choose where we want to put our energy, right. And that little nest or cocoon or like little den around us when it’s like, yeah, this is hard and it’s okay. To soften my life so that I can handle it. Um, I love that. So, well, I really want to thank you for coming and sharing and being so open.

And I love that, you know, you have lots of emotions and you’re able to share, um, through them. Cause I think even having that space to just cry with someone who’s like going to let you cry as long as you can. Like I never, I love it. I am, we welcome tears here and, um, Yeah. I just, I don’t know. It’s been like such an honor to get to be on a part of this journey with you.

And I’m just so excited. Like not everyone gets, you know, a rainbow baby, but they’re also something that’s really amazing to celebrate. And especially given how much. Courage and hope and all of those things it takes to keep trying after what you’ve been through. Um, I just like, I’m cheering, um, for you all the time and like, check in and, um, love hearing that you’re, you’re doing it and, um, yeah.

Yeah, I’m just excited to be able to have this chat with you. So is there anything else, like any message of hope that you would leave people with? Oh,

that’s such a good question. Um, yeah, I guess I would just say that nothing lasts forever, right? Like, however discouraged you might feel right now, And however eternal that might seem to be, um, you won’t, you won’t always feel like that, even if circumstances are different than the way you picture, um, and your story unfolds, um, in a different way than you thought.

Um, it’s It’s possible to, to create the, the life and the feelings, um, that you want within the circumstances that happen, um, in your life. So I don’t know. It’s, it’s, it’s so hard. Like when you’re in the midst of it, there’s really nothing that, um, makes you feel better, but, um, hopefully anyone that is, you know, in the throng of, of losses just knows that they’re, they’re not alone and that.

they won’t always feel devastated.

Love it. Well, thank you so much, Summer. Thanks, Amy. Appreciate it.